Joined: 13 May 2006 Posts: 31 Location: Cold Country
Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 1:26 pm Post subject: Cheaper way to get Robben's tone ?
I know tone is with the player, but equipment does help some. Let's say I have a Standard Tele and a ' blues junior amp, is there a stomp box out there that can help bring that bridge pickup close to the Ford tone ? I know there's the Zen Drive" anything else, other suggestions please. _________________ I love Tele players Albert Collins, Gatton. Roy B,RF - and my guitar of choice.
Joined: 26 Nov 2003 Posts: 916 Location: Fairhope, AL
Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 3:04 pm Post subject: cheap(er) tone
Collinsman, I also use a Blues Jr and I use a Sparkle Drive pedal. You can find them on Ebay for under $100. It has both a clean and distorted boost and you can mix them to get close to Robben's tone.
Frank
Joined: 26 Nov 2003 Posts: 916 Location: Fairhope, AL
Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 5:55 am Post subject: Sparkle Drive
When you find one to try out, you might start with these settings.
From left to right the knob positions are 12 (o clock) - 3 - 3 - 12. You can tweak from there to suit your ears, but that should get you in the ballpark. Have fun!
Frank
Joined: 09 Feb 2005 Posts: 197 Location: San Jose Ca.
Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 10:41 am Post subject:
I asked Robben what he used on "The Work Song" cause I liked the tone on it. He says "you really liked that?" and proceeds to tell me he used Garth's Super, Garth's Fender RF, And Garth's Roland Boss Overdrive pedal (the yellow one). See if you like that tone, even though it's not a Tele.
Joined: 13 May 2006 Posts: 31 Location: Cold Country
Posted: Tue May 16, 2006 4:46 am Post subject:
Red Suede wrote:
I asked Robben what he used on "The Work Song" cause I liked the tone on it. He says "you really liked that?" and proceeds to tell me he used Garth's Super, Garth's Fender RF, And Garth's Roland Boss Overdrive pedal (the yellow one). See if you like that tone, even though it's not a Tele.
Thanks, I'll have to make a trek to " Guitar Center" and try these different pedals. _________________ I love Tele players Albert Collins, Gatton. Roy B,RF - and my guitar of choice.
Joined: 13 May 2006 Posts: 31 Location: Cold Country
Posted: Wed May 17, 2006 5:20 am Post subject:
I went to a music store yesterday and used a Roland Boss overdrive w/ AS Tele through a Blues Deville amp and couldn't get close to the RF tone, maybe because it had the factory *9* string on it - any other suggestions. _________________ I love Tele players Albert Collins, Gatton. Roy B,RF - and my guitar of choice.
Switching to 10s isn't going to make the difference between "Robben's Tone" and "Not Robben's Tone", so I wouldn't worry about the string gauge at the moment.
Exactly which "Robben" tone are you pursuing? Maybe if you could suggest a couple of songs with the tone you're after, that might help.
In the meantime, if you are looking for a sustaining/singing overdriven lead tone, I've had good luck with my Barber Direct Drive SS. If you have a Barber dealer near you, you may want to check one out. Actually, two other Barber pedals--the Burn Unit (more expensive 2-channel version) and Small Fry (less expensive 1-channel version)--may be even better choices for getting Robben's overdriven tone through a good clean amp.
Also, I have a Blues Jr, and it may not be the best amp for Robbenesque tones. I have one of the older, darker models, and I just don't know that I hear much of Robben's sound in that amp. I'm much happier with my Traynor YCV 40 for clean and drive tones.
Joined: 13 May 2006 Posts: 31 Location: Cold Country
Posted: Wed May 17, 2006 12:55 pm Post subject:
Thanks for the input Tom - I know Robben has different tones using the neck or the bridge pickup, different guitars etc, but the tone that really cranks my chain is: 1) ' Blue Moon' track 4, "Make Me Your Only One,'2)-
' Handful Of Blues' track 1, Rugged road. It sounds like a bridge pickup to my ear, but man, it just grabs me. _________________ I love Tele players Albert Collins, Gatton. Roy B,RF - and my guitar of choice.
1) ' Blue Moon' track 4, "Make Me Your Only One,'2)-
' Handful Of Blues' track 1, Rugged road.
OK, some classic tones there.
Of the two, I think Rugged Road is easier to approximate--it's more overdriven, a little less "nuance" if that makes sense. So, there are probably a number of pedals that can get close. Sounds like a bridge humbucker to me, but I'm not sure the guitar/pickup matters much here.
"Make Me Your Only One"--to me, that's a classic example of "Robben" overdriven lead tone, that Dumble sound people are always chasing. Touch sensitive, kind of clean and dirty at the same time, sustain but without tons of compression, etc. That one does sound like a Tele to me.
My understanding is that this is what the Zendrive excels at--and based on hearing Robben through the Zendrive and a Super Reverb on the John Mayall tour, I'd believe it. Perhaps some of the folks who have a Zendrive can chime in here with more on that?
For what it's worth, I actually had a little time this morning, so I broke out the Blues Jr. to refresh my memory, as I haven't used it much lately.
While you can get a nice variety of clean/breakup/overdrive tones playing with the volume/master, I don't think any of those really fall into the Dumblesque/Robben category. Also, it seems a little limited in terms of high and low frequency extension--a function of its size I guess.
But, with the BJ set for a clean tone, I do think my Barber Direct Drive SS can give a reasonable approximation of both tones, depending on gain levels. At the very least, it captures enough of the vibe to allow you to play the kind of phrases you hear in those tunes.
Adding a bit of delay (Digitech Digidelay) after the Direct Drive helps too.
BTW, I've found that cranking the Mid up to 12 on the BJ really brought it to life. This may only be true on the older, darker sounding models, but trying that really brought in some sparkle I had thought was missing on that amp. I was ready to sell the amp, but with that discovery, I'm planning to hang on to it. I usually have the bass up about half way, treble around 8 or 9. For a clean sound, I set the master up high, volume as desired.
So, I'd definitely recommend trying one of the "boutique but reasonably priced" pedals that claim to cop the Dumble tone. Barber's Direct Drive or Small Fry (or for more $$$, the Burn Unit), Alf's Zendrive, etc.
If the budget allows, grab a Fuchs or Two Rock amp, but in the meantime, I think you'll be able to get some good sounds with the BJ and a good pedal or two.
Joined: 13 May 2006 Posts: 31 Location: Cold Country
Posted: Thu May 18, 2006 7:38 am Post subject:
Hey Tom - much thanks for taking the time to help this (tech) hack out. There was a poster who said the vodoo overdrive was good, also is there another not too spendy amp that would work better than the blues junior? _________________ I love Tele players Albert Collins, Gatton. Roy B,RF - and my guitar of choice.
Joined: 26 Nov 2003 Posts: 916 Location: Fairhope, AL
Posted: Thu May 18, 2006 8:42 am Post subject: RF tone
I'm not sure what you mean by not too spendy, but when Robben can't use his Dumble he rents a Fender Twin. He said in a GP interview once that anyone who wanted his tone could come close with a Strat and a Twin. Keep an eye on the want ads and you might just come across a Twin that will sell for less than it's worth. I'm not a big fan of modeling amps, but a friend that works at a local guitar shop demo'ed a Crate 1-12 combo with digital modeling and it was unbelievably touch sensitive. It would go from clean to overdrive just by changing picking styles. It goes for about $300. This salesman is a tube purist from way back and he was impressed with it.
We go through the "it's in the hands - it's in the equipment" discussion here from time to time. I know you realize that a lot of Robben's tone as well as that of a lot of the other fine players here is in the hands. That being said, some of RF's tone is also attributable to the fact that he is really moving some air in from of his amp. A Blues Jr. (and I love mine) just won't push that much air with only 15 watts. I also have a Behringer V-amp 2 installed in an Atomic 112. The V-amp has a Dumble - like setting and it is somewhat touch sensitive, but again, it won't push enough air to really nail the sound. I know this is a lot of rambling but I hope you find something in here that helps.
Frank
Joined: 13 May 2006 Posts: 31 Location: Cold Country
Posted: Thu May 18, 2006 8:55 am Post subject:
Strat and a twin - interesting. I do love the tone he get's on the first two tracks of "Blue Moon' I was thinking he was using a Tele, seeing how the Tele was on the cover, anyway the last time I saw him live he was getting almost the same tone from his sig Fender v/s the Tele, so I guess a lot of it has to do with the hands. I thought Marin in his clip had the RB tone going, but he hasn't responded to my Q yet. thanks Frank for your trouble. _________________ I love Tele players Albert Collins, Gatton. Roy B,RF - and my guitar of choice.
Joined: 26 Nov 2003 Posts: 916 Location: Fairhope, AL
Posted: Thu May 18, 2006 10:35 am Post subject: RF Tone
I'm not sure why Robben made that comment about using a Strat. He rarely uses one. Be aware, too, that his signature model has coil taps for the humbuckers. He likes to tap the coils for rhythm and use the full 'bucker for his leads. Like any generalization, that's not always true, but he does that a lot.
http://home.comcast.net/~machrone/bluesjunior.htm
Paste that address into your browser and you will get the web page of a guy that addresses a lot of mods for the Blues Jr.
Frank
I would add that something like a Twin is probably big-time overkill for playing at home, or even in a small bar or garage or something.
When I went looking for something with a little more complex clean tone and more headroom, I ended up with the Traynor YCV 40WR. Both the clean and the drive channel sound great to my ears. But, the drive channel really only comes into its own at volumes that are a bit too loud for living-room use. For living-room volumes, I tend to use my pedals for overdrive.
The Traynor is comparable to a Fender Hot Rod amp, but I like the drive channel on the Traynor much better, and it's a lot easier to dial in a low-volume clean on the Traynor than on a Hot Rod.
The clean on the Traynor is probably a little better starting point for a Robben tone (more of a blackface Fender clean--like a Twin) than the Blues Jr.
Another modelling amp to check out is the Vox AD30 (I think that's it). Has a Dumble setting or two--sounded good when I played it. Supposedly the key is to leave the master volume wide open, but dial down the output wattage via the knob in back.
Again, though, if the BJ is loud enough for where you are playing, and if you get a clean sound out of it that you like, I'd probably start with a pedal search.
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