Turns out while she appreciated the guitar playing, she really dug the singing. She was over the moon for Start it Up. He feelings were that Robben was very soulful and lyrical. This woman was musically literate and knew the difference between basic pentatonic playing and more sophisticated stuff. But Robben's vocals are what touched her soul.
That captures my wife's feelings spot on. She digs the guitar playing ("Revelation" is probably her favorite Robben cut, but "Start it Up" is right there), but it's the songs and vocal performance that have made her a BIG fan.
I agree that his voice is something of an acquired taste--probably because it is not the typcial deep, bold male voice that grabs your attention right away. I'm fortunate enough to play in a Soul/R&B group here in town with a couple of amazing singers, who have what most would consider to be "better" voices.
But, after time, I've come to find RF's vocals to be very powerful and even soulful. I agree that it's a matter of picking the right material, and of delivering that material with total sincerety. Check out the version of "Start it Up" on the "Ohne Filter" DVD--the way he digs in for the choruses is just amazing.
A little story:
Having heard a lot of good things about RF, as well as a couple complaints about his singing (and vaguely remembering "Talk to your Daughter"), I downloaded the first 8 tracks from Blue Moon as part of a free trial on one of the legit on-line music venders (Emusic I think). I probably didn't give it enough spins to really sink in, but for whatever reason it never quite caught fire with me. Certainly the vocals didn't really appeal to me much, and I guess the tunes/guitar playing didn't excite me enough to overcome that.
Flash forward a bit, and Keep on Running is out and getting excellent reviews, so I decide to buy a copy. Pretty much love at first listen. I suppose the guitar work grabbed me first--love the way the first notes of the guitar solo on the title track just bloom out of nowhere. But the singing was right there, on every track. Can't explain the difference in the immediate appeal of that album vs. Blue Moon, but there it is.
A few months later, my wife and I caught the show at Martyr's here in Chicago, and witnessed an incredible performance. Bought the "Ohne Filter" live DVD at the show, and probably played it 20 times in the next two weeks. We were hooked, and a rash of CD buying ensued.... And I love Blue Moon now. Go figure.
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2004 2:32 pm Post subject: you must buy......
Hi FatTeleTom,
good to have you on board!
You must check out "Supernatural". It is robben's most definitive vocal collection to date. This was even the actual thought from Robben himself as he apparently concentrated on the vocals on this album. It remains one of my personal favourites.
cheer's,
DD _________________ Music is the universal language; speak it with emotion, listen with a passion.
I know of a lot of fans who share the original posting's sentiment. They're fans of Robben's guitar playing first and foremost. Despite what you think of what makes a great blues singer, there is something about his voice which doesn't quite resonate for a lot of fans but I don't think any of them feel that it's worth complaining about.
I too have never been crazy about his voice but at the same time but I'm not really preferring the instrumental stuff any more as a result (especially the Jing Chi...shudder). I think that Robben's guitar playing is so much more interesting in the context of a song. While there's nothing wrong with the ocassional instrumental, albums like "Handful of Blues" say so much more than something like "Tigerwalk".
In the end, as I'm starting to lose interest in his solo material, I honestly wish he would do more sessions with some of the great vocalists/songwriters out there. I wonder how many offers he gets or turns down for sake of persuing his own projects? What collaborations would really sound phenomenal?
Joined: 04 Nov 2003 Posts: 886 Location: SF Bay Area
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2004 8:14 pm Post subject:
My second favorite guitarist (after Robben) doesn't sing. Although a brilliant guitarist, he toils in obscurity as a sideman. In an up-front position like a guitarist, you kind of need to sing and lead the band. That's the way it goes in this genre. There aren't too many blues singer/saxophonists, or even bassists or keyboard players. The only exception is a singer/harp player, but now your dealing with someone on stage who can only solo.
When I grumble about the dearth of gigs, folks always tell me I need to put my own thing together. That's what the audience expects. Fortunately they seem to tolerate my mediocre singing for the rest of it.
The first time I heard Robben was bringing home Handfull Of Blues. The first notes of Rugged Road turned my life around in a way that hadn't been done since Bloomfield and Blues With A Feeling 30 something years earlier. When Robben started singing (that song has fairly powerful vocals) I didn't fall over the same way but thought it was serviceable. Listening throught the rest of the album, I thought he sounded more like a country singer than someone consistent with the way he played guitar. Over time, more albums, more knowledge of Robben's background, I got used to the sound of his voice.
I don't mean that it's an aquired taste, more like you listen through the timbre of it to hear the rest. Kind of like listening though Scofields strangled cat tonality to hear the brilliance of his playing. After awhile, you start to notice variations and develop preferences for certain periods or styles of delivery. Then you go back and find new nuances in the periods you set aside and start appreciating them. Pretty soon, you wonder what your original objections were.
I felt this way about the Blue Moon album. One listen and it went in the pile. There wasn't any of that style that I looked to Robben for, and he would do live. A couple of years later I put it on to listen to a certain song and discovered new aspects of the songwriting, production I had originally thought of as weak, a rounder singing voice, return of his guitar tone to a fatter "BlueLine" sound, and more. Now it's the Robben album that stays in my car changer while other things go in and out.
Our outlooks and tastes change. This has been a lesson to me in being more open and less quick to judge. _________________ There are no such things as wrong notes, there's only the look on your face.
My Stuff: www.stevekirbymusic.com
Joined: 09 Jun 2004 Posts: 289 Location: Baltimore, Md
Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2004 4:24 am Post subject: A common thread...
A common thread, or thought, that is running through many of these posts is: "When I first listened to album XXXXX, I didn't really care for it. Now I can't stop listening to it!"
It's amazing how many folks, including me, are having this experience. This really speaks to Robben's genius and the depth and nuance of his music. When you just look at his diverse resume, his ecclectic influences, the variety in his recordings, etc., it's obvious that this is not your average Joe guitar slinger.
It's not that I go ga-ga every time hear a Robben recording that's new to me; I don't. In fact, I've disregarded as much of his music as I've initially swooned over.
But after repeated listening, I've been drawn back into much of what I had casually dismissed. This has happened too often for it to be coincidence; this guys music is sublime and runs deep. (I'm currently in the middle of a "Supernatural" epiphany.)
It's not that Robben is an extraordinary guitarist, a great songwriter, a fair-to-middlin' singer, an all-around nice guy...he seems to be all these things in spades.
But when you add up all the pieces, the whole ends up being much greater than the sum of the parts.
Is this genius, I don't know...but I DO know that it's not something that comes along everyday.
So what if Robben is not the greatest singer...Barry Bonds ain't the greatest base-stealer, either!!!
Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2004 7:43 am Post subject: Re: you must buy......
diatonicdude wrote:
Hi FatTeleTom,
You must check out "Supernatural". It is robben's most definitive vocal collection to date. This was even the actual thought from Robben himself as he apparently concentrated on the vocals on this album. It remains one of my personal favourites.
Yep, love Supernatural. I tend to think of it as an album by a top-flight singer/songwriter who has teamed up with an amazing guitar player. It so happens the singer/songwriter and guitar player are one and the same!
Definitely an album that takes some time to work its way into your brain. I think I only really liked 1 or 2 songs on the first couple of listens. Now, I couldn't imagine skipping any track.
With the possible exception of the Barry Bonds analogy (I had forgotten he was such a prolific base-stealer myself), I think Andy R pretty much nailed it---with RF, you get depth and nuance, in spades, and material that you appreciate more and more with time.
Joined: 26 Nov 2003 Posts: 916 Location: Fairhope, AL
Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2004 8:14 am Post subject: Yes, but can he sing?
I have to say I'm in the group that likes to hear Robben sing. I love his instrumental stuff, but the whole package really makes it for me. "Start It Up" has always been a favorite of mine, too. I agree that his singing has improved over the years. He really has developed a good solid tone, and his phrasing has always been good.
BTW, Kirby Kelley is a great blues singer, as well as a phenomenal guitarist. Murali Coryell has a voice that sounds like Sam Cooke and has opened many times for B.B King. There's two more white boys who can sing the blues!
My only problem with Robben's singing is that I don't get to hear it enough!
Frank
Michael McDonald?
Greg Allman?
Doyle Bramhall II?
SRV?
EC?
Johnny Lang?
Donald Fagen?
David Clayton-Thomas?
......................................and on and on
and of course the greatest of all time.......
John Belushi & Dan Aykroyd
I rest my case!
It's a gross generalization..............
If I listen to 10 white blues guitarists who sing and eight of them stink, and then go on to say that "white guys can't sing the blues" - that's a gross generalization.
If I listen to 10 white blues guitarists who sing and eight of them stink, then go on to say that "most white guys can't sing the blues" - that's merely an observation.
Your list:
Michael Macdonald:
Isn't a guitarist, sells himself as a singer/songwriter - not as an instrumentalist - so it's really not the issue I was discussing. Besides, I think his singing is awful.
Gregg Allman - Yes, he can sing the blues and soul beautifully (one of the few), but again, I was talking about guitarists who feel compelled to sing, for various reasons, though their singing is nowhere on a par with their playing. Speaking of Gregg - I never heard Duane sing anything; he stuck to what he did best.
Doyle - he can definitely sing, but isn't a guitarist and known more as a singer/songwriter.
SRV - OK, I'll grant that he was a soulful blues singer, and was probably among the few that can pull off the whole blues singer/guitar slinger routine - though I am not sure I would buy an album of just his singing...
EC - I don't find him to be much of a singer - and not that exciting a guitarist, but that's just me - and judging from record sales, it is literally just me who doesn't think he's that great :-)
Jonny Lang - ick.
Donald Fagen - a distinctive stylist and composer - but not a guitarist... though he has pretty awesome taste in guitarists...
David Clayton Thomas - not bad, but no guitar...
Really, the guys who can do both are a very small group.
Just to show I will accept that a white player can do it - I'll submit Warren Haynes as just one example, off the top of my head. But I still submit that most of the guys who try to pull it off fail - another example - Roy Buchanan - awesome player, horrible singer.
I understand that marketing concerns often come into play here, and part of the reason guys like Jeff Beck aren't known as well as guys like Clapton (though I'd submit that Beck is the more accomplished and innovative guitarist) is that Beck doesn't sing - and one sappy "Tears in Heaven" gets more notoriety than a groundbreaking "Blow by Blow".
Maybe guys like Robben really need to team up with a guy who can really sing, following the example of Anson Funderburgh, a really good blues guitarist who, instead of subjecting us to yet another mediocre voice, teams with the soulful Sam Myers on vocals (and shares billing with him - "Anson Funderbergh and the Rockets, featuring Sam Myers", or something like that) - or look at Santana, for instance, there's a guy who's had an entirely revitalized career through collaboration with singers.
Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2004 8:30 am Post subject: Singing
Hi , i am not able to quote everybody but :
It's might be a fact , here in Europe i know a lot of people not specially addicted to guitar slingers who love Robben's music & VOICE, specially women (around 80%) (( Well i do know 'coz i am spreading Robben's wave a lot ). How funny is that !!!! because here in France & in America i met some people thinking Robben will not ever make it big in Blues (in US ) 'coz
he doesn't have the kind of Jack Daniel & Tobacco voice (come on you see what i mean , kinda ACDC healthy ((urk urkk))). It's a shame for me but i 've stresses this out once in a thread : trying to share Robben's music with a guy who is only speaking about gary moore ...............................
Anyway for me guitar geek i didn't pay that much attention to Robben's singing since it always pleased me From inside story and even before,
i love talk to your daughter and this outakes Outlaw blues , it always just made me feel like it could be fun to sing your heart out, easy and pleasy,
till may be Mystic Mile were i realized he was heading in a special direction of his own and he was pushing his limits as a true songwtriter ( i mean as a true bluesman).
EDITED 'COZ OF MAX HAMMERSMITH , hello you can tell everything 'bout your personnal tastes but HOW DARE YOU quote Buchanan as you did , i am sorry dude but if you own a Telecaster now you must pass it to me .
Not to tell about your others assesments ............................ You forgot to shoot Johnny Winter by the way.
Now a question for all : Have you ever tried (or do you ) to sing while playing????? Or to try to sing or just be enough relax to bring on a melody without doing any clams ( that simple , you all know what i mean ...)
IT's A HELL OF FUN. Whatever think the people . Funny enough in this world "the people" oftenly refers to fellow musicians comin' to cut you in pieces about your "awful" singing (& playing) meanwhile a lot of "normal" people enjoyed a soulful moment. IN this way i really agree with Bluerun about how great is to be enjoyed with a great story along with music , no matter the voice , the melodic intent is great to tell a storie no need to be anita baker or Raquell ferrer , it"s blues anyway...................................
And Max Hammersmith the way you talk, do you happen to know a guitar geek named RED ROOSTER?
Last edited by Bluelobster on Thu Sep 23, 2004 8:52 am; edited 1 time in total
Joined: 17 Jul 2003 Posts: 908 Location: Tampa Bay, FL
Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2004 8:49 am Post subject: I love EVERYTHING about Robben's music, but....
I enjoy hearing Robben's voice "live", in-concert MOST of all. I think when he performs live, his voice is a little more expressive and resonant. I think recordings of his live shows also capture the soulful energy I admire in his voice.
And, regarding your last comments... I prefer Anson's recordings with Darrell Nulisch over his work with Sam Myers. I also dig Rusty Zinn's voice. _________________ Travelling by train of thought
Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2004 9:02 am Post subject: Re: Singing
Bluelobster wrote:
EDITED 'COZ OF MAX HAMMERSMITH , hello you can tell everything 'bout your personnal tastes but HOW DARE YOU quote Buchanan as you did , i am sorry dude but if you own a Telecaster now you must pass it to me .
Not to tell about your others assesments ............................ You forgot to shoot Johnny Winter by the way.
Now a question for all : Have you ever tried (or do you ) to sing while playing????? Or to try to sing or just be enough relax to bring on a melody without doing any clams ( that simple , you all know what i mean ...)
IT's A HELL OF FUN. Whatever think the people . Funny enough in this world "the people" oftenly refers to fellow musicians comin' to cut you in pieces about your "awful" singing (& playing) meanwhile a lot of "normal" people enjoyed a soulful moment. IN this way i really agree with Bluerun about how great is to be enjoyed with a great story along with music , no matter the voice , the melodic intent is great to tell a storie no need to be anita baker or Raquell ferrer , it"s blues anyway...................................
Oh, yeah right - I did forget Johnny Winter, and no, he shouldn't sing either... ;-)
Please note that I believe both Roy Buchanan (I wasn't aware I had "quoted" him...) and Robben are amazing guitarists and musicians - but it's hard for me to listen to Roy sing and imagine that - (1) it was his idea to sing (2) that he enjoyed it much (3) that he thought he was a good singer. And I don't have a Telecaster to give, but there are plenty of people who own one that they should give away to someone...
I figured someone might get around to saying, in effect - "can you do better?" Probably not. I have sung with bands I have played guitar in, and people tell me they like my voice and ask me to sing more, but I know better and consequently, these days I sing only to my wife, who shows her appreciation for my earnest attempts.
Please don't tell me that you aren't allowed to have an opinion on a matter of art unless you can do it better - otherwise there would only be a handful of people qualified to talk about music, films, paintings, sculptures, etc. and the rest of us would just have to keep our (unqualified) opinions to ourselves.
Max "The Hammer" Smith (hey thanks for the new blues name - I like that!)
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