Joined: 10 Jul 2004 Posts: 71 Location: northern California
Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 9:11 am Post subject:
For my LP I'm wanting a smoother tone than my '59 and JB. I put some cheap Mighty Mite pickups in the LP copy that I have, and although the neck is a little too muddy and the bridge is too thin, yet they're a lot smoother than the '59 and JB.
So if I could get a pickup that is smooth but not muddy or thin, I'd be happy.
I have to say that I listened to some of your songs, and the Seth Lovers do sound good. But when they're distorted, are they still smooth?
I'm kind of thinking I'd like a Larry Carlton-ish tone on the overdrive. To me, his tone is really smooth. _________________ www.mrseamusic.com
For my LP I'm wanting a smoother tone than my '59 and JB. I put some cheap Mighty Mite pickups in the LP copy that I have, and although the neck is a little too muddy and the bridge is too thin, yet they're a lot smoother than the '59 and JB.
So if I could get a pickup that is smooth but not muddy or thin, I'd be happy.
I have to say that I listened to some of your songs, and the Seth Lovers do sound good. But when they're distorted, are they still smooth?
I'm kind of thinking I'd like a Larry Carlton-ish tone on the overdrive. To me, his tone is really smooth.
I would say that Seths are your choice. I was about to say that you could try Seymour Duncan Alnico 2 pickups, which are smoother than Alnico 5 pickups (JB and 59), but since you mentioned Larry, I'd say try to find a pair of Seths (even) used.
Are Seths smooth under distortion? For normal fusion like soloing - yes. Yes, Larry-like. Riffs sound like Kossoff from Free or some Jimmy Page.
Joined: 10 Jul 2004 Posts: 71 Location: northern California
Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 9:26 am Post subject:
Thanks, marinblues. I will definitely check into them. Someone else had mentioned them, but I was just concerned because they're not waxed.
But if it's not a problem (even around computers), then maybe they're the way to go. _________________ www.mrseamusic.com
Joined: 04 Nov 2003 Posts: 886 Location: SF Bay Area
Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 12:14 pm Post subject:
Because Robben can alter the amount of high end at will with his right hand (and he has such a fat tone with his left hand) he tends to choose very open pickups, with balanced and extended top ends. The PG's sounded so open compared to the choked off sound of the 59 when he played them. For some folks, this might be too much top depending on their amp and the way they play.
I had thought that Larry played fairly gently (compared to Robben who in his own words beats the guitar to death, I think he has much more touch than that but that's the way he looks at it). The other day, I got my hands on one of those Valley Art's Strat things that LC used on Last Nite. It didn't sound all that good until I started playing it as if it had 008's on it. Then the tone warmed up and it sounded like a great guitar. On parts of Last Nite, it sounds like Larry is really laying into it, but I think he's going from really gentle to kind of firm. Robben tends to use a lot of dynamic range in his playing. Notice how he usually doesn't turn the guitar down but still plays comps behind Bob or whoever else is there. So I think that Robben's pickup selection has a lot to do with complementing the way he plays. Which makes going off his choices really tough of the rest of us _________________ There are no such things as wrong notes, there's only the look on your face.
My Stuff: www.stevekirbymusic.com
Joined: 10 Jul 2004 Posts: 71 Location: northern California
Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 3:44 pm Post subject:
Aeolian wrote:
Because Robben can alter the amount of high end at will with his right hand (and he has such a fat tone with his left hand) he tends to choose very open pickups, with balanced and extended top ends. The PG's sounded so open compared to the choked off sound of the 59 when he played them. For some folks, this might be too much top depending on their amp and the way they play.
I had thought that Larry played fairly gently (compared to Robben who in his own words beats the guitar to death, I think he has much more touch than that but that's the way he looks at it). The other day, I got my hands on one of those Valley Art's Strat things that LC used on Last Nite. It didn't sound all that good until I started playing it as if it had 008's on it. Then the tone warmed up and it sounded like a great guitar. On parts of Last Nite, it sounds like Larry is really laying into it, but I think he's going from really gentle to kind of firm. Robben tends to use a lot of dynamic range in his playing. Notice how he usually doesn't turn the guitar down but still plays comps behind Bob or whoever else is there. So I think that Robben's pickup selection has a lot to do with complementing the way he plays. Which makes going off his choices really tough of the rest of us
Yeah, I see your point. I play very softly. Never used to. I just started in recent years when I took the guitar up again.
When I think I'm about to make a decision, something else grabs my attention.
It shouldn't be this diffucult.
I'm also looking into Gibson Classic '57's. What's your opinon on them? _________________ www.mrseamusic.com
Thanks, marinblues. I will definitely check into them. Someone else had mentioned them, but I was just concerned because they're not waxed.
But if it's not a problem (even around computers), then maybe they're the way to go.
Humbucking pickups reject hum/noise by virtue of the fact that they have a second "humbucking" coil. Whether they are potted or not won't really affect that much. However, unpotted pickups tend to be microphonic and feed back easily at volume, and tend to be touch sensitive, so it you hit the pickup with your pick when playing, you will hear it through your amp. I think that bothers me more than the feedback problem. FWIW, I have had 3 sets of Seth Lovers and 2 sets of Antiquities, and they all had the same problem. And personally, I don't hear any difference between potted and unpotted pickups, so I prefer to lose the problems and go with potted pups.
I know that a lot of people want unpotted pups because the original PAF's were not potted and they want that sound. However, what they overlook is the fact that the PAF's they are hearing now have got 40 years of sweat, dust, dirt, smoke and who knows what kind of gunk built up inside them, which almost makes them potted. Maybe Duncan or somebody should come out with a pup filled with gunk!
Joined: 10 Jul 2004 Posts: 71 Location: northern California
Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 3:04 pm Post subject:
I was checking out some Bill Lawrence pickups, and it says his are made with alnico 3 magnets.
What would be the difference in tone between alnico 2 and alnico 3? _________________ www.mrseamusic.com
So what about Gibson Classic '57 pickups? Are they basically SD Seth Lovers only potted?
In theory I believe that's more or less the idea. But in practice, there is a lot of variation in the '57 Classics. One set may sound great while another set will sound crappy. They also seemed to change over the years. I'm afraid it's kind of pot luck with those pickups.
I haven't tried these so I can't say anything about them, but they seem to be pretty well known and liked by the Les Paul crowd:
Joined: 10 Jul 2004 Posts: 71 Location: northern California
Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 7:16 pm Post subject:
I'm not sure I want to spend $300 for pickups. I would really have to be impressed with the tone, and I wasn't with the sound clips on the website. _________________ www.mrseamusic.com
Joined: 08 Aug 2003 Posts: 943 Location: Terra Firma, Ether Sea
Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2004 12:41 pm Post subject:
Bill Morgan wrote:
kirk95 wrote:
I believe they are stock....
Yes, but Daved recently mentioned that Robben had tried some Burstbuckers and was interested in trying them out. Any more word on that Daved?
We contacted Gibson, who sent us a set of the 3 model Burstbuckers. However, they all came with the standard humbucker 2 lead windings. I dropped them, and Robben's LP, off with Jim Foote at Musicworks who is putting in 4 wire leads so we can split the coils, and then installing two of them in the most popular configuration.
We're hoping to test them out during our upcoming techday so I can swap them out before we leave for Japan, if he doesn't like them. _________________ B C-ing U!
( }:-Daved
"This boy's diseased with rhythm!" -Bing Crosby (Road To Rio, '49)
We contacted Gibson, who sent us a set of the 3 model Burstbuckers. However, they all came with the standard humbucker 2 lead windings. I dropped them, and Robben's LP, off with Jim Foote at Musicworks who is putting in 4 wire leads so we can split the coils, and then installing two of them in the most popular configuration.
We're hoping to test them out during our upcoming techday so I can swap them out before we leave for Japan, if he doesn't like them.
I'll be looking forward to result of that techday. I am in the process of buying a '01 Tom Murphy Historic Les Paul with '57 Classic pickups like Robben's Les Paul, and I am interested in trying a set of Burstbuckers in that guitar. Actually, I hope Robben likes them so I can hear them here in a couple of weeks.
I have a 99 LP HR that I originally installed the Seth Lovers into, and then over the next year acquired very good, high output original PAFs. I almost fell on the floor when I looked up current prices today! In my non-scientific, non-expert comparison (my ears) they blow away the Lovers. This is the best tone I have ever owned, and would never part with it.
On a related note, I ran into a well known tech in my area who was in the small audience when Robben's early 90s video stuff was shot at the old KTZZ studios with Don Mock. He said that Robben told him that he had replaced the stock pickups in the signature model he was using with original PAFs and loved the tone. He also said the BL jammed for about 4 hours straight, and that it was pretty good. ;)
Do you guys with more experience with the electronics side of things have any comments about old PAFs relative to newer reproductions, besides the gunk factor? _________________ - Mayer
Joined: 10 Jul 2004 Posts: 71 Location: northern California
Posted: Fri Oct 08, 2004 1:11 pm Post subject:
Well I recorded a little bit today with the current pickups in my LP, and the neck is pretty muddy when distorted. So I need to get something - although I don't know what yet. _________________ www.mrseamusic.com
I have a 99 LP HR that I originally installed the Seth Lovers into, and then over the next year acquired very good, high output original PAFs. I almost fell on the floor when I looked up current prices today! In my non-scientific, non-expert comparison (my ears) they blow away the Lovers. This is the best tone I have ever owned, and would never part with it.
With a set of PAF's going for at least $2k these days, I'm afraid that's an option I won't be exploring. Have you had a chance to compare the PAF's with any of the other wannabe's, like the Antiquitie's, Voodoo's, Fralin Unbucker's, Burstbucker's, etc.? I'm searching for something to replace the pups in my Les Paul.
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