Robben Ford Discussion

[johnnyd]

Hi folks,

I own an Esprit, and wanted to upgrade all of the hardware on it. I was thinking of a TonePros bridge and new tuners, but I am not sure what parts would fit? I do not want to drill or modify this guitar in any way to make hardware fit.

Has anyone upgraded their Esprit? I am looking to upgrade this stuff WITHOUT having to drill or modify anything. I want to be able to just pop in the bridge and tuners without any modifications.

Any advice or help would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!
JD

[chalky]

I nearly changed the bridge for a tonepros unit. The bridge unit is very poor quality on my guitar. The saddle slots are rough and probably over-deep and two of the saddle screws are very loose, resulting in an anoying lack of sustain and tone on the B string. I found a TonePros bridge at a good price at a European web-based company. The website incorrectly specified the unit (model T3BT) as having 4mm posts (as found on the Squier Esprit). When I received the bridge, it had 6mm posts and therefore would not do the job without replacing the posts and inserts in the guitar body(!), so I had to return it. The TonePros bridge does look great quality (stamped 'TonePros - made by Gotoh' underneath). The saddles were all nice and snug. I'm not convinced that locking the bridge to the posts will make a hage difference to tone compared to a good quality standard unit with well-fitting posts. The unit I ordered was pre-notched, and the notches looked very neat (if perhaps a little shallow). I have never got into the detail of notching a bridge unit and mistakes could be very costly.
If you want to go this route, visit the TonePros website first, the correct unit appears to be the T3BP, which is pre-notched and designed for the 4mm posts.
The company I ordered from does not stock this model, so I had to return it and I am doing nothing more till I know I got my money back.
I have made some improvement to the original bridge by using epoxy resin in the saddle screw holes to reduce clearance betrween the screws and the bridge. This has actually helped reduce saddle screw vibration and increase sustain, so I am not too desperate.
I did think about changing pick-ups, but since changing the volume pot on the bridge pick-up from 500 ohm to a new 1000 ohm model, the tone has brightened nicely and I am quite happy. I also added a coil-tap switch, which works great.

[johnnyd]

Sounds good, chalky. I added bright caps to the stock volume pots and that seemed to add a little brighter tone over all.

What did you use for a coil tap switch? Push pull pot?

Do you think a standard gibson bridge might work instead of the Tonepros? The jury is out on TP's for me as well.

Did you consider changing the tuners? Again, I think these are pretty crappy stock, and I am looking for a quality repalcement without having to drill, etc.

Overall I love this guitar, and I am truly surprised at the overall qualtiy of a $300 Squier. I would just like to raise the quality a bit with some basic hardware mods. Squier stuff is usually horrid, but these guitars are truly killer!

Thanks for any help or advice!

[chalky]

I also fitted treble bleed capacitiors to the volume pots. This helped, but I felt I got much closer to what I wanted when I changed the value of the pot itself. By the way, the pot values were 500k ohm originally and I changed up to 1000 K ohm (1 Meg Ohm). I mis-stated the values in my original reply. Still haven't changed the neck pot. It was the bridge pick-up I was most unhappy with.
The coil tap is a mini dpdt flip switch. Cheap, but it does the job. There's room for the switch in the control cavity routing.
I would definitely consider a Gibson (or other quality brand such as Gotoh or schaller) if lower cost than the TonePros design as I am not worried about the bridge falling off when I change strings (one of TonePros claimed advantages). I thought most people changed the strings one at a time, rather than taking all the old off before fitting the new... As I said, I'm not convinced that significant difference in tone would be gained using the locking screws on the posts as long as the fit between the posts and bridge is not sloppy.
I haven't considered changing anything else currently, but I agree that the tuners are not great. I spend quite a bit of effort stretching strings when I put a new set on, but tuning stability still takes a while to settle down on my guitar. Of course, this could also relate to the bridge saddle notches and the nut (which probably isn't great material, or particulary well cut). The pick-up selector is also not great quality and changing that would be relatively cheap and may improve the signal path somewhat.
There is not much point spending lots of money on a cheap guitar when the wood itself will be a barrier to greatness, but I am sure that the bridge will feature at some stage.
At the moment it would just be great to have the time to play the damn thing!

[AndyR]

Chalky, this is off-topic, but your handle has reminded me of a joke:


Q:What do you get when you mix vodka and Milk of Magnesia?

A: A Phillips screwdriver



Andy

[chalky]

I'll try anything once. Make mine a double!

Andy

[Aeolian]

You can get the Gotoh bridges directly from Stewart MacDonald www.stewmac.com or lot's of music stores. A poorly put together bridge really does rob tone. And the saddle notches should be half the diameter of the string, you don't want the string to be deep in some slot rubbing against the sides of it. Or worse, in a slot with a long flat bottom so that there isn't a definitive bearing point.

I replaced the stop bar in my 335 with the Gotoh version of the Gibson aluminum bar. I like the effect. It livened up the guitar a bit. Lost a small bit of solid bottom end, but all the Esprit's I've played have a nice centered sound, so if you want a bit more livelyness, that's another option.

You can go crazy on pickups. No limit to the madness there. Last I heard, Robben's black Baker had a Pearly Gates in the neck and 59 in the bridge. What's in the various LP's he's been playing lately is listed elsewhere. Gene Baker is high on the Dimarzio vintage pups. Have fun.
_________________
There are no such things as wrong notes, there's only the look on your face.
My Stuff: www.stevekirbymusic.com

[chadd]

[cymruhangu]

[chadd]

I haven't noticed a difference in tone with the TonePros bridge. To be fair, I installed it a only a day after receiving the guitar. I also replaced the strings and adjusted the action for a different string gauge during the change. I bought my Esprit used on eBay knowing that the original bridge's finish was corroded, so I purchased the new bridge at the same time. I suppose the proper experiment would be to play with the TP bridge for a few minutes, then slack the strings and reinstall the original bridge keeping the same strings, check that the action is the same height, and then play for while.

Even if I can't hear a difference, I think the TonePros bridge is a superior design. The intonation adjustment screws fit more tightly and would seem to be less prone to rattle. Clamping the bridge to the posts removes a lot of slop, so the intonation would seem less likely change between string changes. Customer support is excellent. I emailed them to inquire about post specs and they mailed me a pair of chrome 4mm posts and thumb wheels free of charge.

[maxvsf]

I got a wine red Esprit recently to use when I travel. I had local tech Gary Brawer install the tonepros bridge. It was a huge improvement in tone and sustain. The stock bridge rattled and buzzed like a sitar. I don't understand about having to remove the pickup to adjust the locking screws? Do you have it on backwards?

[chadd]

I think I have it on correctly. The TonePros website says that the T3BP has "many improvements including intonation adjustment on the pickup side". The hex locking screws are on the same side as the intonation adjustment screws, which puts them about 3/8" behind the pickup. I suppose I could flip the bridge around, but then the ramps of the saddles woud face the neck instead of the tailpiece. Perhaps other models like the AVR-II are intended to have the screws on tailpiece side?

My original bridge did not have rattles or buzzes, which probably accounts for my not noticing a difference in tone or sustain. I'm sure there would have been a drastic difference if the Squier bridge had been buzzy.

[DaveH]

I have one of these, and after changing out everything which gets screwed on, lapping the frets, and changing out the nut, it is a great playing and sounding guitar.

I used Gotoh tuners,Stew Mac bridge&tail piece, DiMarzio&Duncan pickups, CT pots.

I play it on this recording;
http://media.putfile.com/Bad-SignThrill-Gone

[cymruhangu]