Robben Ford Discussion

Devin · Member Joined: 10 Mar 2004 Posts: 25

I'm a rabid Robben Ford fan, and am dying to know if anyone is interested in trading live shows. I DO NOT SELL ANY OF MY SHOWS!!!! I've purchased (multiple) copies of all his official albums, and have seen him many times. I don't believe in bootlegging for profit, I'm just interested in sharing some fantastic live music.

dodgeboy · Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2004 7:32 pm Post subject:

Devin,
I feel the same way you do. I just finished up 2 B&Ps for some guys on the east coast.
I think it is great to help spread Robben's music and kick the bootleggers in the butt at the same time by tradeing unofficial live recordings amongst
the fans.
Send me an email with your list of shows and I will do the same.
Never for sale never for profit...it's all about the music. Cool

gitarz*r*us · Member Joined: 29 Sep 2003 Posts: 33 Location: Bay Area

For what it's worth, I think by unauthorized recording and/or "trading" bootlegs of recorded live performances, you are still disrespecting Robben's wishes. As an artist, he has a right to limit his recorded output to only those performances he deems are worthy of release. In addition, proliferating recordings of Robben's performances might make it less likely that someone will purchase the authorized recordings down the road. Let your conscience be your guide.

Bluelobster · Posted: Mon Mar 22, 2004 1:31 pm Post subject: tell me

come on GitarZ , tell me how many boots you own

dodgeboy · Posted: Mon Mar 22, 2004 5:21 pm Post subject:

Let me start by saying I believe everyone has the right to their opinion and I respect that. I only replied because I love a healthy debate where there is respect on both sides. I also am very passionate about this subject.

1- As an artist, he has a right to limit his recorded output to only those performances he deems are worthy of release.....
On this you might have a point.

2- In addition, proliferating recordings of Robben's performances might make it less likely that someone will purchase the authorized recordings down the road....
The only people I feel who would put the time and effort necessary into aquiring any live shows without the aid of a trader network are the "super fans". These are fans like yours truly who have upwards of 25 "official" releases went to all 4 nites at the recent Yoshi's stand...you get my meaning,not at all to boast just set'n a base line. I wonder first off if you have any idea how difficult it is to aquire quality live shows from an artist as unfortunatly "obsqure" as Robben. These things are not readally available. Not all are even of a quallity worth listening to more than once when they are finally aquired. But oh those gems that are awesome....I can't tell you how it feels to listen to a quality live show you've traded with another fan ....it makes the hunt all worth while!!! The last point I will make on this comment is, even if I had a pristine soundboard recording of my most favorite Robben show...the minute I found out he was releasing it "officially" I would not hesitate to pre order it!!! My reasons...they would have everything to do with sound quality and furthering the artist all I can. I enjoy & respect the man and his music that much. I would seriously doubt I am alone in this zeal. Espically around here with the "super fans"

3- Let your conscience be your guide.....
I can say with a clear concince that I have never turned a dime off of any live show I have in my collection, Robben or otherwise. I invest...some would probabaly say foolishly... in my collection with both time and equipment. Blank discs , high end editing software, 24 bit soundcards ect....all so I can share a quality product with other fans. Unlike "bootleggers" where quality is down near the bottom of the list and profit is at the top,I am passionate about the product I share with others. You can't imagine the thrill I get when I do say....a 6 disc "B&P"....record and send 6 discs of live material for the price of their return postage.... for a fellow fanatic who has little or nothing in his/her live collection and to hear how much he/she enjoyed my product. It is a thrill to bring some one musical enjoyment. There's also a feeling that comes from having something that's so special it's not for sale... at any price....esp.this day in age.

4- The up side to all of this I.M.H.O., is Robben's music gets spread for free,thus we take the market away from the "bootleggers". If you have any doubt as to how powerful a respectful and honest tradeing community can be...do a little research on the early history of The Dave Matthews Band. There music spread like wildfire without even an "official" album on the shelves. Just by tape traders.

It's All About The Music....Never For Sale...Never For Profit.
dodgeboy Cool

elizabeth · Posted: Mon Mar 22, 2004 7:53 pm Post subject: Okay, I'm stupid...

What's a "B & P?" (Sorry, I don't get out much.)
love, elizabeth
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dodgeboy · Posted: Mon Mar 22, 2004 11:41 pm Post subject:

B&P stands for Blanks & Postage.
Where a person with a few or no shows yet to trade sends a specificly agreed on number of blank discs in a post paid envelope to another trader to record music on. This trader then sends the newly recorded shows back to help grow ones tradeing base.

elizabeth · Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2004 6:02 am Post subject: Ohhhhhh.

Thanks.

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Aeolian · Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2004 4:17 pm Post subject:

Daved must be either busy or tired of this subject but if you look back through previous threads you will see that Robben's camp is adamantly opposed to any unauthorized recording or distribution of his performances, regardless of the intentions of the recordist. There has been much intelligent discussion on the merits of various other forms of music distribution. And maybe at some point, someone will develop an argument that will cause Robben to change his mind so the debate should continue. But I for one would not openly disrespect a favorite artist by publically participating in an activity that they have gone on record as opposing.

I don't want to appoint myself the Robben police, I have just noticed this thread going on for awhile and was supprised that Robben's position hasn't been clearly stated yet.
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Devin · Member Joined: 10 Mar 2004 Posts: 25

I suppose having (re)created this debate, I should weigh in. Like most of us (all of us?) in this discussion, I own all of Robben's official releases, have seen him live many times, and have turned many people on to his music - either by giving his cds as gifts or by taking people to see him perform, which is the best way to really appreciate his incredible talent.

Unfortunately, as has been noted, the paucity of official live recordings makes those performances all the more fleeting, and almost necessitates the unofficial trade of his live shows. After all, how much poorer would we, as music fans and musicians, be if there were no document of Robben's live shows?

I mean no disrespect to Mr. Ford, and intend to support him and his music however I can. As an (aspiring) guitarist myself, I treasure those moments that have been captured - both officially and through the labor of dedicated fans. And I certainly understand the amount of effort and time it takes to create a work of music. Ultimately, though, music is meant to be shared. The true fans - those who love Robben's music, who anxiously anticipate his next release or the chance to see him play, who get chills upon hearing him take a solo - will always be his greatest advocates, and will never resort to bootlegging for profit. I suspect that most of us would not even find it in us to take such a course. And all of us would jump at the chance to purchase high-quality official live recordings. Make them available, and I'll be the first in line. Until then, I'll be waiting for the next studio album, getting out to see him as much as possible, and, yes, trading his live shows with other true fans, in the hopes that I may be able to get someone else as excited as I am.

So, if I have offended, then I am sorry. Please understand that I hold Mr. Ford in the highest regard, and my intent is only to relive those moments of brilliance and introduce more people to his music.

PierreL · Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 1:45 pm Post subject:

Well said.

dodgeboy · Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 2:32 pm Post subject:

And all of us would jump at the chance to purchase high-quality official live recordings. Make them available, and I'll be the first in line. quote: devin.

No you won't cause I'm gonn'a beat you to the store... I leave'n now.... Laughing

dodgeboy

Daved · Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 3:01 pm Post subject:

Let's see, once all these stores and chains (Wherehouse, Tower, etc. ) that are in trouble and going, or have already gone, out of business.... where exactly will you buy your CDs?

Especially when all these record labels (Arista, Elektra, etc.) that are going, or have already gone out of business.... where exactly will your favorite artists produce these CDs you want to buy?

Certainly not online. After all, that's where you go to get any music or movies you want for free.

Oh, that's right.... bootleg taping and illegal downloading does not effect the industry in any way other than to encourage quality & sales. That is, after all, what all the bootleggers and tapers keep saying, isn't it?

Let's add this up, shall we?

NO product + NO marketplace = NO revenue/support for starving artists

And don't tell me it all makes things easier for ANY common artist to sell his product... it doesn't. Sure it makes it easier for Joe Schmuck to put out any inferiorly produced product, but the second he does, someone else will promptly turn around and bootleg it back onto the internet to make it available for free.

No one will be able to afford to produce quality or single out superior talent anymore.

Sorry, but ALL the artists and merchants I deal with are having a very hard time buying that logic as their business and livelyhood gets pulled out from under them.

Mark my words, people, enjoy those things while you can 'cause those who support these practices will make it all go away in the long run.

I found it interesting last night, as I browsed e-bay for a bit, to see that someone has a copy of Bob Malach's CD up for sell and they are using one of MY photos, lifted from MY TechTalk site, WITHOUT MY permission, to advertise this CD. Not even a thank you or an acnowledgement. That's just outright stealing.

Technically there is nothing illegal about that, I guess, but morally & ethically they are thieves of the same nature as all these tapers and bootleggers which this modern generation so badly wants to condone, sanction, and support.

Now, please don't hang me. I'm just expressing my right to not appreciate those who steal from me, just as artists like Robben have the right to not appreciate their craft being stolen from them.

It only seriously makes me consider NOT making MY photos available for theft off the internet.
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Devin · Member Joined: 10 Mar 2004 Posts: 25

Not to harp on this, but did you miss the part about buying multiple copies of Robben's official cds and paying to see him play live? Not to mention the desire to buy more official music.

I don't go online to download free movies and music. If I like it, I pay for it.

'Nuff said.

Daved · Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 3:30 pm Post subject:

Good for you, Devin. Really!

But, tell me, why DO you buy it when it is available for everyone for free?

Like you, I BUY and SUPPORT my favorite artists and products.

But you and I are only one person and for every ONE person like you there are thousands more who want it all for free and they are the ones who are killing this business.

And, my friend, sadly, it IS a dying business.
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B C-ing U!
( }:-Daved
"This boy's diseased with rhythm!" -Bing Crosby (Road To Rio, '49)